August 01, 2006
Qana's Unresolved Questions
Yesterday's attempt to analyze the Israeli air strike on Qana, subsequent building collapse seven hours later, the Hezbollah propaganda campaign that resulted, and the media's seeming inability to ask hard questions about the events led to a flurry of analysis in the blogosphere yesterday.
I asked questions here and here, first questioning why the media obediently provided Hezbollah's point of view while ignoring the timeline presented by the IDF, then progressing on to note apparent discrepancies in the macabre media filed day Hezbollah provided as it paraded around the bodies of dead children for a scandal-hungry media's eager consumption.
Blog EU Referendum cast heavy suspicion on Hezbollah's stage management of the event, astutely noting the presence of an individual tagged "Green Helmet" who's apparent role in Hezbollah in brandishing the corpses of dead children for the world media's cameras extends back a decade.
Dan Riehl of Riehl World View notes with suspicion that refrigerated trucks from Tyre arrived before the media was allowed near the scene of the Qana strike, and suggests that bodies from the Tyre morgue may have been added to the Qana body count that the Lebanese Red Cross officially stated was roughly half that, of the widely reported 54-58, at 28.
Predictably, Hezbollah's defenders labeled those questioning the version of events provided by Hezbollah to a carefully controlled media contingent as conspiracy theorists for noting the apparent discrepancies in the story Hezbollah provided the world.
Air Force Chief of Staff Brig.-Gen. Amir Eshel officailly questioned why the building collapsed seven hours after the IDF air strike, and senior IDF officers explicitly noted the possibility of a "Hezbollah-planted explosive device."
Why did the world media so readily accept Hezbollah's claim that it was Israel's air strike that brought the building down? Why have they investigated the officially noted discrepancies in the timing of the collapse?
As asked here on Confederate Yankee, why were the bodies Hezbollah said were recovered from the scene seemingly inconsistent with the dead and injured of other collapsed buildings? The same forces of nature occur in every building collapse, regardless of whether the collapse is intentional (implosion or explosion) or unintentional (faulty construction, etc). Buildings of concrete such as the one in Qana generally produce a substantial amount of fine concrete dust that blankets nearby surfaces to such an extent that it almost appears to be volcanic ash, especially when explosives are involved in their demolition.
We saw examples of such dust on survivors form the World Trade Center collapse.
We see the same thick dust coming from small buildings that collapsed because of earthquakes 75 years ago.
And almost all of us have witnessed the massive clouds of dust released in the television broadcasts of the hundreds of controlled demolition of buildings around the world.
Irrefutably, building collapses release a massive amount of dust into the air. This is even more apparent—or is at least is much more documented in the media—that buildings that are collapsed by explosives.
And yet, when we look at the bodies of those reputedly recovered from the building in Qana, only a handful of those are covered in the heavy layer of concrete dust. If all of these bodies were recovered from the same basement or shelter as Hezbollah claims, then why are the bodies so unevenly coated? Why do some appear all but free of dust at all?
I have little doubt in my mind that the baby brandished by Hezbollah's "Green Helmet" is indeed a building collapse victim because of the thick layer of dust on the body.
But what of so many of the other bodies that Hezbollah claims were pulled from the same basement bomb shelter?
Note that these bodies—whose rigor mortis within two hours of the buildings collapse I've already questioned—are remarkably clean in comparison.
I do not doubt that women and children died in Qana. The Lebanese Red Cross officially stated that 28 were recovered from the rubble. But do I question who died, and how many actually perished.
"Pallywood" has a long and well-documented history of falsifying tragedies, from the questionable death of Muhammed al-Durrah to the Jenin Massacre, where many of the same sources that are unquestionably buying into Hezbolla's Qana story reported a masacre they were later forced to admit never occurred.
Qana has every possibility of being another Jenin.
Will the world listen this time?
* * *
Perhaps even more important than the possible (if not probable) Hezbollah exaggeration of the Qana dead is the story of why these women and children died in the first place.
Hezbollah has made the decision to embed every aspect of it's military apparatus within the civilian population of southern Lebanon, placing ammunition stores, command and control facilities, rocket launching sites and Hezbollah barracks within residential neighborhoods, hiding under the skirts, as it were, of Lebanese housewives and their children.
As Ed Morrissey notes today in the Washington Examiner:
We want to see civilians spared the horrors of war, and we push combatants to take all possible steps to achieve that end. The Geneva Conventions have that explicit mandate, and the world should remain constantly — and consistently — vigilant.Unfortunately, the global community has failed miserably at this task, and this war not only highlights that failure, but springs from it. While the world holds Israel to this standard, things become curiously silent when it's time to hold Hezbollah responsible for its conduct of war. Hardly a word has escaped from the U.N. or Europe on the 2,500 missiles that have rained down upon Israeli civilians, deliberately targeted by Hezbollah. Those attacks have displaced more than 300,000 civilians, a fact the global community and the mainstream media ignore.
Those who argue that Israel has occasionally violated the Geneva Conventions in its attacks casually ignore the blatant violations of Hezbollah, whose combatants wear no uniform, deliberately hide in civilian populations and fire weapons from residential areas. Hezbollah conducts none of its operations within the rules of war — and yet world leaders and the media never mention it.
Why? Because no one expects terrorists to follow the rules. This is the soft nihilism of low expectations.
The villagers in the areas surrounding Qana were warned by the IDF to leave five days earlier. More than 150 Katyusha had been fired out of Qana against Israeli civilians (which no one in the media seems to want to talk about) including missiles fired from outside that very building the night of the Israeli air strike.
Israel has taken every reasonable precaution it can to prevent civilian deaths, but the battlefield Hezbollah has chosen makes civilians deaths all but impossible to avoid.
Hezbollah has killed their own yet again, and it is to the world's shame that this continues almost without complaint.
Low expectations, indeed.
Kind of a manual trackback since the originsl didn't work. Anyway also worth noting that there was a large professional banner produced in Beirut mentioning Qana mere hours later whihc would have taken a good day to produce by most professional print houses
My post - http://www.di2.nu/200608/01.htm
Why should be believe Israel's version of events? They've been caught lying too many times, and besides, it is their MO to deliberately target non-combatants.
Posted by: catnapping at August 1, 2006 01:57 PMDid "catnapping" forget the rockets fired from Lebanon are not only targeting non-combatants, but were fired first? Also, it is the Hezbollahs' ongoing tactic to posistion themselves amongst non-combatants. The hatred of Israel is so entrenched, the sacrifice of a few "friendly" innocents is a small price.
Posted by: 2cups at August 1, 2006 02:35 PM
What if the bodies of children were from an Israeli attack in Tyre rather than a building collapse in Qana? How does that change the fact that Israel is killing civilians?
Even if one did not care about Arab peoples, the Israeli campaign is counter productive, inflaming the Muslim world beyond the Arab states, and further reducing whatever political goodwill the US has left in the world.
Hugh -
I wonder if you would call it unproductive if you lived in Israel, or a place with similiar battle lines.
Is it really that unproductive when you force a Army away from your border? Especially when that army is a "NGO"?
Let me guess, you think Israel should go to the UN for help.
Posted by: Kirbside at August 1, 2006 04:35 PMCompare the above pictures with this Pulitzer winner from the Murrah building.
http://home.beaumontenterprise.com/specialsections/devastation-date/html/photo_defines_tragedy.html
Compare the OKC firefighter holding Baylee Almon with the "people" holding those poor children. Compare their conditions.
I'm not saying they didn't get killed in the fighting, but it is reasonable to say they weren;t killed _there_!
Posted by: Quilly Mammoth at August 1, 2006 04:54 PMWhat if the bodies of children were from an Israeli attack in Tyre rather than a building collapse in Qana?
Are you serious?
for starters it makes the death tolls from the Qana attack greatly exagerated and a lie.
You understand it also calls into question every death toll reported by Hezbollah right?
Cat,
You have that backwords. Hezbollah are the ones that have been lying since before Carter was in the WH. Isreal is just defending itself.
How many times should you let a bully push you around before you do something?
Go here, click on the "Pallywood" video. It says it all.
seconddraft has the video. It's worth watching
Congratulations!!! YOU MADE The Jerusalem Post!!!!!
Bloggers raise questions about Kana
By D. IZENBERG,J.SIEGEL-ITZKOVICH AND N. ROSEN
(on the second page)
For example, according to the antiliberal Conservative Yankee blog, 'The child in the photo shows no signs of injuries - no blood, no disfigurement or crushing wounds consistent with a building collapse. The two men [carrying the child] show no signs of having been digging in rubble. Their clothes are unbelievably clean, especially the black fatigues that would so easily shown concrete dust.'
Bloggers raise questions about Kana
OMG if you love conspiracy theories you must read this one.
That makes sense, we were fool by the Lebanese, there were not victims in all those Israeli bombings, the Hezbollah are trying to influence our opinion filling the gapes with death bodies from other situations.
Wait, I read a month ago that in Indonesia a malefic “terrorist” organization stole 10,000 death bodies of the victims from the last tsunami.
Well, on the other hand, those Hezbollah “terrorist” must have some kind of dealing with Osama Bin Laden because I can’t understand how come they were able to buy those “flying Refrigerated trucks”. Since all the roads are destroyed in Lebanon and is not easy access to Qana.
Oh stupid me, this is part of the conspiracy theory, the flying refrigerated trucks are UFOs, and can’t seen by human eyes when they are flying around.
Of course: that’s why all the bodies are crushed and in pieces, they fell from the UFOs and crash in the land.
Also the Lebanese are aliens, because they all are same, all those pictures were from the same kind of alien, even the ones from the confederate Yankee website (http://confederateyankee.mu.nu/archives/188768.php) and the other blogs too.
(http://eureferendum.blogspot.com/2006/07/milking-it.html)
(http://eureferendum.blogspot.com/2006/08/green-helmet-mystery-continues.html)
NOOOOOOO wait, he is the main alien, in one of the photos he is even dressed as an Israeli soldier, watch this:
(http://eureferendum.blogspot.com/2006/07/who-is-this-man.html)
I started thinking that the Israelis and the Lebanese’s are from the same planet, they are the same, they want us to be separated and take one side or the other, they want to dominate the earth.
We must pressure the USA,Russia & China to bomb Israel & Lebanon since the whole place is full of aliens.
NOOOOOOO, I forgot that Israel is the best ally of USA, all in the USA must be aliens too, WE ARE FUCK!!!!!!!!
Now I can put the pieces together, I will be the first to conclude this conspiracy theory, but its too late, there are some men in black all around my house, I can see them from my windows, they are approaching to my door.
Oh my god, I have to send this before they get me………run for your life….
…………………………………………..Sending………..…………………………….
I just don't get the logic of the left. Let's see. Hezbollah, Hamas, PLO say that their goal is to wipe Israel off the map. For 40+ years they have engaged in terrorist attacks against innocent men, women, and children - non-combatants. They have killed thousands of innocents through these terrorist attacks. Hezbollah continues to fire rockets indiscriminately into Israel - not at military targets, but at civilian targets. Fire and forget. But to the left - the people who come here and call names - that is just fine. Why? Simply because it is against Israel?
Did children get killed at Qana? It would seem so. But look at the pictures coming out of there and remember that everything you see is controlled by Hezbollah. The majority of the pictures show what - about maybe 10 bodies total? And not only that, but we see the same children over and over being carried around by the same "rescue workers". Why weren't the photogs standing next to the building snapping away as each body was pulled out? Instead they seem to have followed "Green Helmet" around and took pictures of him with the same children over and over.
The other question here is "IS THERE A WAR GOING ON?" The answer is yes. Do the people on the left really think that war is bloodless? That once an army gets involved (as opposed to random terrorists getting onto buses with explosives strapped to their chest), there isn't collateral damage? To those who say - "Israel is targeting civilians" I say if they were then there would be thousands and thousands of dead civilians. IAF would not go after specific buildings with precision guided munitions. Instead they would use regular iron-type bombs and would just drop them without caring where they hit (gee - kind of like the rockets Hezbollah is shooting). It's a lot cheaper to use those types of munitions.
There is no doubt that when provoked Israel pushes aggressively and ruthlessly. Wow - big surprise. That is what war is about. But the big question - and one I have not seen answered by one single person condemning Israel is - who caused all of this? Why did it happen? Who is really at fault? If you truly think that this is Israel's fault, you really are wearing a tinfoil hat.
Posted by: Specter at August 2, 2006 10:05 AMGeez,
I can see it now. According to the left - people like catnipping (you should really lay off that stuff - it's not good for you) - is that Israel purposely targeted that building knowing there were women and children inside. Is that logic? Or is it non-thought?
Yea right - the IAF says, "Hey there are thousands of buildings around here with civilians in them and quite a few with military targets. Let's pick this one that only has civilians and use a really expensive precision guided weapon to make sure we wipe all of them out. Then we will get so much good publicity. Don't worry about the military targets though...."
That is exactly the logic that catnip used. Incredible. Incredibly illogical.
Posted by: Specter at August 2, 2006 10:11 AMAnother issue that appears phony to me: in some of the pictures inside the building, where green helmet man and others are recovering bodies, there is an unbroken concrete ceiling above them and unbroken concrete block walls surrounding them in an area where the bodies are covered with powdery dust. Where did the dust come from, if not from overhead. It just looks unlikely to me...
Posted by: One_American at August 2, 2006 10:52 AMYou want a conspiracy theory, how about this: There is no war, it never happened, this whole thing is nothing more than one more Karl Rove political stunt. It is all designed to draw either Syria or Iran into a war and it has to happen, and it will happen, surprise, surprise, by late October. The murdering of children is the ultimate provocation, and that's the exact intention. If Syria and or Iran cannot be goaded into war, bombing will begin in October regardless, so their message is, You might as well take the bait now because we just keep picking at you, humiliating the Arab people, destroying innocent villages and causing more damage until you come out and attack us. In the words of Karl's clueless drunk puppet, "Bring It On." This war the neo-cons have been manstrabating over for over a decade now.
Why the neo cons want this war goes back many years. It arose in Y2K apocalyptic Limbaugh triumphalism no reality based details can ever derail. For Cheney and von Rumsfield it goes back even further, the red menace, the bay of pigs and the compact Herbert Walker on the Grassy Knoll. Today as the details about 9/11 are beginning to unravel and more people are beginning to suspect something stinks, your O'Riley sarcasm over the very term conspiracy theory wares thin. Everything is a conspiracy theory unless both Fox News and Buzzflash.com are both always true at the same time. This invasion of Lebanon is Cheney's war, few doubt it. The right wing noise machine and even hate radio opinion masters have been told to call it a proxy war.
Why they want the war now is all politics. First it keeps the complete debacle in Iraq off the sheeple's minds and it keeps other troubling details off the front pages such as the complete and total full scale refusal of the people of Mexico to allow another election to be stolen. For almost a month now the nation on our southern border has not had a recognized president and it has never made the news in the US once, all thanks to Cheney's war. So you want a conspiracy theory here it is. Sure Qana happened. Murdering children and humiliating the entire non-Jewish Middle East is the exact mission at the moment so to goad Syrian and Iran into a war in time for the November elections. This is Cheney's war and even the Israeli military know it's a colossal disaster.
Hey Yankee,
I see you too posted a response to Morely at WaPo. Nice job and great work on this Qana incident.
Cheers, AJStrata
Posted by: AJStrata at August 2, 2006 12:54 PMHi all,
First things first, I'm an Israeli, I live in Israel - so if any of you people who have an "auto-blame-Isrel" response - read everything before you start blaming.
First, let's get the facts straight:
1) This war started with an attack by Hizballah, which ended in the deaths of 8 soldiers and the kidnapping of 2 soliders. Please remember that they attacked within the ISRAELI border, which is UNDISPUTED - specifically by Hizballah who claims the area known as "Shab'a Farms" is Lebanese territory - while the UN says it's Syrian.
2) Following their assult on our soldiers, the fired rockets on CIVILIAN targets. Luckily for us (Israelis) the people who live near the border are well trained and know to go into shelters.
3) In the past 6 years, since we left Lebanon (A step most Israelis agree to, but most don't agree with the way it was done) all of us hoped that it'll be quiet - especially since we complied with the UN to the letter (a village was actualy cut in HALF to comply). Not a lot remember, but a couple of months ago, Hizballah tried to kidnap soldiers by attacking directly from that split village (and failed - losing several soldiers).
4) As for the Qana so-called massacare, in order to massacare someone there has to be intent, having served for several years in the IDF, I can assure you, none of us are bloodthirsty, most of us like the good life. The other side has been known to use tragedy in the propaganda war. It's true that people were killed, but remember this is war. I didn't see the world crying out when NATO bombed the shit out of Serbia in 1998 (killing a whole lot more civilians than soldiers...), when the Russians made Grozny one big parking lot (I belive that was in 1996), when the US bombed Iraq... you know what - I don't either - it's war and in war civilians get hurt. The important issue is the intend - do we intend to have civilians die? no, we're sorry for each death, but sometimes it can't be helped, especially if the enemy is hiding within civilians.
5) According to the Geneva convention, a fighting side which hides within civilian population is in direct violation of the convention. You think about that.
6) Now, you must remember that what we are dealing with here are Islamic Fanatics (and I have no problems with Muslims in general), they are shi'eits - they belive they have to suffer, they believe death is a great reward. There can be no peace with people who would rather die than live, since peace requires both sides to want to live better.
7) For the person saying that the US wants this war - I happen to agree, what is going on in Lebnanon is a war between Iran and the US but the soliders are IDF and Hizballa (for those of you who don't know arabic - Hizb = Political Party, Allah = god -> The Political Party of God). So I agree with you, I don't think it's a bad idea since Iran (which are all Shi'eits) is working hard on getting a Nuke... and once they have that... well... let's just say that the world won't be a better place for it.
And for all you people out there - everyone hopes that this war will end soon enough. We would really like to get back to living normally (as normally as we can in Israel at least). But our enemys have to remember, we can be pretty stubborn when we need to be.
Posted by: Ender at August 4, 2006 02:42 AMNah...this stuff is NEVER faked.Here's a video of Palestinians faking a death at a funeral.Oddly to me....is if someone even TRIED to kill just women and children..the success rate wouldn't be as high as the terrorists claim.
Posted by: Lonewolf at August 6, 2006 05:17 PMFirst time I have heard this called Cheney's war. Interesting.
Ender, you and people like you are the reason there is an Israel. Israel exists because people like you are willing to stand on the land, to fight for it, to bleed for it, to die for it if necessary; Isreal exists because her people have paid a high price for her in blood and tears. As long as you and people like you live, Israel will live also.
Stand strong.
Bunch of sickos over here!
Posted by: Dan at August 7, 2006 06:16 AMIs it really the war of Lebanon, like Hizballah is trying to say?
I doubt it seriously.
How can you understand that this war begins at the summertime? I mean this is the time of the tourists and lebanon would have much of them at this time of the year!
Every one who had been to Lebanon knows that the best time to have a war against a normal army, like the israeli army, is at the winter time. So why did Hizballa gave up this advantage?
maybe because at the end of the day most of the important decisions are comming from this freeky guy in Theheran?!
