Great post. That Liberal article where they bash Bush and the military was awful. As soon as some Lib used the words "Baby Killer", I was done.

There is really no question about how Libs see us. Any apparent respect they show for the military is sarcasm.

Gee Whiz, jerk. I guess that made Ronald Reagan one of those who committed on of those, how did you put it, "...vile act still practiced by some crude thugs...". I guess Ronnie had the stones to take responsibility for the horrible sadness that resulted from his orders. The Shrub had no stones, has none now, and never will have any. Nor will his vile father who could never face the consequences of his decisions. Gee. Like father, like son.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_fRmm3JSBP-c/SusoVm8l8DI/AAAAAAAAAN0/s_RTUjroCLI/s1600-h/Ronnie+Facing+his+Responsibility+for+Death.jpg

Paste this address in your browser if you have the stones.

As Matt Yglesias once put it: 'When I die, please feel free to use me as much as possible to promote the causes I support and believe in'
What would be completely unethical and particularly scummy would be to use someone's death to promote some issue or cause which they did not support or believe in.
Like when the Republicons used 9/11 victims to push for a war in Iraq.
And going to a military funeral- sounds to me like that is the RESPONSIBILITY of those in the chain of command. Such as the Commander in chief. Of course, Bush didnt go to any of the funerals. Clearly he did not believe that their safety and deaths were his responsibility.

The media hyped this in our neck of the woods as something that an American President hasn't done in 18 (?) years. As if inviting the press to catalogue and then praise the Idiot in Chief for for a photo op is an achievment for "The One" (oh wait, that is what passes for achievement with this wanna be).

President Obama's visit was meant to salvage his reputation.

AHAHAHAHHHAH! Yes! Obama's reputation is ruined! No one likes him because he persecuted two wars with criminal incompetence and that's why his approval rating with every polling firm is like between 20-30%.

Oh wait, that's not Obama, that's the last guy.

Your Dear Leader got how many troops killed in the Iraqi WMD snipe hunt? Yeah, Obama's the one that the military doesn't like, I'm sure.

salvage, if you really want to know what the military thinks, all you have to do is read.

This one, from the mother of one of those soldiers who gave their lives when Bush was in office would shame you... if you had any shame:

I admire Pres Bush for understanding that some moments are so incredibly personal and private. I can state first hand that my son's flag draped casket coming of the plane was THE MOST emotional moment of my life. It was far harder than the funeral. In that moment the reality that there was no mistake and your child is truly dead hits you. You welcome them home and say goodbye in a moment. At his funeral although we were surrounded by 100s of people they allowed us our time to say final good bye to our son. His Military brothers and sisters honored him then also. Having someone like the President at either of these two event would have made it a circus. Pres. Bush understood that...and gave the family the privacy they need in that moment. He comforted them later privately when they were ready to meet with him.

Obama on the other hand obviously doesn't get that.... I question why he went to Dover. I question why the press was even notified. If this was truly to honor the fallen and comfort the family he could have made the middle of the night journey without fanfare. I hope he looked into the eyes of these families. I hope he listened to who these men were and how they lived their lives. I hope he sees those who serve as real people now...but I doubt it.

Go back to attacking the military, salvage. Feigning support is not something your kind does well.

RayGun did it, it must be okay.

You can make all of the excuses you want, but the article nailed Bush as the sociopath and coward he is.

All of you "troop supporters" are engaged in the usual preferred pastime of wingnuts: Transferrence and projection.

You don't support them, deep down you hold them in utter contempt. And you are completely ignorant of this fact.

You seek to salve your putrid, rotted souls with fake "patriotism" and feel-good sloganeering in your idolatry of militarism and it's cannon-fodder. You worship the murderers and abhor the murdered.

Suck it, GOP. America (and it's armed forces) finally see through your lies, crimes and propaganda. Hope you enjoy electoral oblivion. It's so much less than you actually deserve for your evil deeds.

Wow, CY. You struck a nerve. Just look at all the lib trolls cockroach scurrying around. Cockroaches, all of you.

Reagan did the exact same thing as Obama, you drooling, knuckle dragging morons.

Oh, and by the way, salvage, your "arguments" would be much more impressive if you would improve your grammar and spelling. "Persecute" means torture. "Prosecute" means carry out. I suggest that you buy a hardcover copy of Webster's Collegiate Dictinary and keep it on your desk. Your uninformed tirades would be much better expressed, although not one whit more convincing.

Marianne Matthews

Every time one of these brave Americans dies, "Progressives" get a 'tingling' up or down their legs.

RETHUGLICANS - QUIT YER WHINING!!!

Desert Diva

The response that you received with this post shows that you hit a mark. Anytime these liberals start in on Bush and start being mean, then you know you have made a truthful point. I agree, Obama is nothing but a media slut. He will do anything to get a picture. If he were really concerned about the troops, he would do something to support them. Instead you get the sense that he is waiting for the next opinion poll or to get his socialist legislation through congress before doing something that could isolate his base.

D-

Supporting the troops would mean pulling them back from a useless situation, not mindlessly encouraging them with money.

Supporting the troops mean providing sufficient facilities to help them re-adjust to life in the civilian world.

Supporting the troops means prosecuting contractors who rob us, the taxpayer, all the while they "provide" decrepit facilities for those same troops.

But, that is right. The war-mongers are only in it for the money. Sad we have allowed such cretins to destroy our society, placing profit before health, their own profit before American lives.

IntelVet - men and women of the military re-adjust to civilian life just fine, thank you.

Why do you think otherwise?

And what does this have to do with the President using the bodies of brave men to pretend that he is one of them? President Mememe couldn't even be bothered to meet with Medal of Honor winners at their inaugural ball.

Air Force One, the movie starring Harrison Ford, Obama serf, was on here tonight. The film portrays the President as a valiant figure who defies terrorist fiends and saves the day, biff, bam pow. But toughness is out today, and sensitivity is in. Hence the trip to Dover. I don't like Obama or his character, but I feel for his problem in Afghanistan, since I have friends and family who have fought and worked there. The place demands a fifty year commitment for "victory" but his own masters in the left elite rich won't even tolerate 5 months from him.
Too, he must feel personally that many will die if he commits force. Yet he showed his weak but dominant political side by going there with photographers, expecting to enhance his image as a caring CIC.This was probably a reasonable calculation given his servile following. But I think he should have arrived alone and, perhaps, had the affair reported, but without showing the posed salute, which itself makes him look like a well dressed Ken doll. Obama had no respect until recently, so he doesn't know how to show it properly. Maybe he never will.

When I saw the picture of Obama, straight backed, feigning solemnity while saluting, it looked so put on, so not in character. Then when I clicked through and read where he was and why it made perfect sense, but seemed even more pathetic. He may really want to be the commander in chief in this kind of serious, solemn way, but he just isn't yet. Not when we know he golfs and fund raises and wings off for the Olympic bid, yet can't find time to meet with his general, is decisive as hell on an immediate stimulus package and taking over health care, picking czars and tax cheats, but has to spend months pondering whether to send help to the troops already in Afghanistan, the war he campaigned on. The bow in Saudi Arabia was totally believable, but the salute in Dover - no.

When George W. Bush was photographed in a flight suit after his flight to the now famous aircraft carrier, liberals went absolutely berserk. They went berserk because Bush looked authentic. He was a fighter pilot and knows how to wear the gear, how to walk in it, and how to behave in it. It looked like second skin on him and made all liberal pretense at military credibility look like, well, pretense. We all remember Michael Dukakis and the tank, no?

Which brings us to this pathetic incident. There are some things one simply does not do, such as invite yourself to someone else's funeral, or having been invited, bring along some of your closest friends in the national press (!?). If Obama was truly wanting to honor our fallen soldiers, if he was truly wanting to gain insight to help him make decisions, could this not have been done without the press? No, not for Obama, for no matter the topic, no matter the occasion, no matter the gravity of the situation, it's all about him; everything is all about him.

Thus we have a photo of Obama saluting. George W. Bush knows how to wear a flight suit. He knows how to salute. He knows that one honors military dead and their families privately, and absolutely and always without the salivating jackals of the media (how, pray tell, could one possibly be more intrusive on the privacy and feelings of these people?), and he knows that one never, ever uses our fallen soldiers and their families for propaganda and personal aggrandizement. Obama is no more believable in the role of commander in chief than Dukakis was as an M-1 commander. He's just not authentic, and no amount of posing can make him other than what he is: A craven, small time Chicago machine politician and thug who, in the embodiment of the Peter Principle, has risen far, far beyond his terribly limited competence.

"George W. Bush knows how to wear a flight suit."

Yep...complete with a vial of cocaine in one pocket, a bottle of Old Grandad bourbon in another, a get-out-of-duty-free letter from daddy's golf buddy in another and a rolled-up tube sock in his drawers to fill out the testicle-free crotch.

An event known forever as Operation Dress-Up.

Sad that real patriots died in Vietnam while this drunken fratboy was skipping out on his numerous bar tabs and flunking his flight physicals due to being a coke addict.

"Sad that real patriots died in Vietnam while this drunken fratboy was skipping out on his numerous bar tabs and flunking his flight physicals due to being a coke addict."

Actually, it's been proven over and over that he completed his duty. The fact is that it's sad that real patriots died in Vietnam while sopping female body parts in Washington plotted to throw millions of Vietnamese and Cambodians to the wolves.

Sad that real patriots are dying in Afghanistan while the sopping female body part in chief outgolfs Bush and shoots hoops with his campaign contributors.

o/t

http://rumcrook.wordpress.com/2009/10/31/wake-up-america-obama-is-a-radical/

the list of radical guests to the white house including terrorist ayers is unbeleivable.

you are known by the company you keep. this president is a disgrace

Wow. You've got the O-bots Fired Up!, Bob. Ready To Go!

"Supporting the troops mean providing sufficient facilities to help them re-adjust to life in the civilian world."

Yeah, I adjusted just fine, thanks.

Hey Libs, you know how many combat veterans read this blog? Quite a few. And you're braging about "Stones" for clicking a link. Libs know nothing about stones. Clicking a link? Really? Think about that for a second.

I might not agree with Cons on some issues, but there is no way that Libs will win an argument about who has genuine respect for the military.

This Liberal commenter perfectly expressed the Left's hatred of Conservative's respect for servicemen.

"...feel-good sloganeering in your idolatry of militarism and it's cannon-fodder. You worship the murderers..."

Here's a hint. If you're making an argument about how much you respect servicemen, you might not want to call us "baby-killers", "cannon-fodder", and "murderers". Durp. Beleive it or not, it actually weakens your argument.

I invite any jv liberals to square away your bretheren. This thread would be a good place to start policing your own.

Or silently consent.

To those who have served, as have I and, I suspect, many others who post here, there is a clear distinction between honoring our military, living and dead, and posing for a photo as a political prop. We mention Presidents Reagan and Bush because they so clearly fall into the former category, and Democrats such as Bill Clinton--whose disdain for the military was and is legendary--John Kerry, who is among the most dishonorable men to have ever worn the uniform, and Barack Obama, whose only concern is for himself, fall into the latter.

It is, of course, nearly worthless to try to present facts to liberals, because all that matters to them is the favored narrative of the moment. But do recall, please, that President Bush served, voluntarily, as a fighter pilot, and the record is clear: he did volunteer for Vietnam duty but was turned down as the air war was winding down, the aircraft he flew was not a type being used in Vietnam and he did not have sufficient flight hours for immediate assignment--by the time he was able to transition into another aircraft, there would have been no need for his services in Vietnam.

The problem with this remains the fact that there is no excuse for involving the media in what is likely the most intensely private and poignant moment any human being can bear. President Bush understood this. He spent untold hours meeting privately with family members, visiting troops in the hospitals and war zones, and did not take the media along for self aggrandizing photo ops. In fact, the media was unaware of much of his service in this manner. When he surprised troops with visits, their response was overwhelming and heartfelt because they knew he cared for and believed in them. Contrast this with President Obama, who always brings along the media to photograph him, and who, on one famous occasion, had his advance people screen troops to place only those who voted for him in view of the camera, and who actually handed out digital cameras to the troops so that the media would dutifully record those hand picked troops shooting snapshots of him.

Who, after all, would even think about inviting the media to photograph someone else's funeral or the arrival of the coffin of their loved one? Not only is that impulse incredibly inappropriate, rude and insensitive, it speaks of a malignant narcissism that is dangerous, dangerous for us all.

We're forced to ask: if the 18th family had refused to have their son's casket photographed, would Obama have shown up at all?

What else would explain the red-eye timing of the trip?

Positively vampiric.

Wow, can't handle the truth from a real military vet so you delete my comment? How pathetic is that?

It's called we have conversations like rational adults, Dave, without resorting to childish profanities to make up for a lack the vocabulary. Read the comments policy, and conduct yourself with dignity and respect.

Otherwise, yeah... I'll dump your comments.

Who among us can forget Obama cancelling his visit to the Landstuhl Military Hospital during his European celebrity tour in 2008 when informed he could not drag along campaign staff and members of the media? I forget, did he play basketball instead?

Coward. Gotcha.

Dave, you really don't have the composure to express yourself without swearing?

You must have learned that in your high speed unit. When you became a real veteran, as you put it.

How many times did Obama say "I" during his photo op? How many times did Reagan? The answer to those questions says everything.

You only need to understand two things to grok the modern American Liberal/Democrat. The first is that the only real objective of the ALD is power. The second is that the primary method of achieving that power is sophistry.

When you analyze the things the ALD does and the things ALD says while keeping in mind the two core ALD values I have described, then everything makes sense.

Coward. Gotcha.

No, you clearly don't got it, Dave. I'm a fairly foul mouthed sort (and I blame the Irish.) But Bob does not appreciate profanity on his blog, and having an understanding and respect for that, I've never had a comment deleted here. Which is mostly because I've never made one I know he'll delete for violating his standards of decorum.

You'll notice, Dave, that your inane insult remains. Maybe you could try your argument again, in terms that are appropriate on this blog. You can order McDonald's without getting tossed out, can't you, Dave? Try making an argument that way.

With hope,

A Real Veteran

Oh Cornfed Manatee, it's cute that you think that one mother is the end all and be all of military opinion of Bush but I guess you didn't notice Bush's approval rating was in the toilet amongst the soldiers and their families as well.

That is a fact, by the way, Bush is the most hated President in American history and you voted for him, twice! That's all anyone needs to know about you.

So what reputation is it that Obama is trying to "salvage"? You don't actually say. You do know that he didn't start the Iraq invasion right?

salvage - You're just pretending to be srupid, right? You're not this way all the time are you?

Geez, 17 out of 18 isn't too bad is it?

...I guess you didn't notice Bush's approval rating was in the toilet amongst the soldiers and their families as well.

Cite?

where ever O'dumbo appears, twelve guys in blue suits should show up and salute. You know, to show respect for him.

"So what reputation is it that Obama is trying to "salvage"?"

How about the image he's acquired playing golf, shooting hoops and other dithering activities while our soldiers die in Afghanistan? How many days has it been since Gen. McChrystal requested more troops?

Personally, I think that the photos of the flag draped caskets are appropriate and respectful. Bear in mind that there was a ban in place for 18 years that shielded the American people from the true cost of our wars.

It's also worthy of noting that photos aren't taken if the family of the deceased doesn't want their loved one's coffin to be photographed. In the past, as I understand it, these photos weren't allowed even if the families DID want it.

Really, this isn't a conservative vs. liberal issue. You're simply attempting to create a controversy, where none exists, for your own personal ideological agenda, in my opinion.

Furthermore, I consider it to be deplorable to make a political issue of what in reality was a respectful visit by our President to the place where the bodies of our fallen soldiers are returned to their families and to their country.

Shame on you.

Brando foamed thusly:

"Here's a hint. If you're making an argument about how much you respect servicemen, you might not want to call us "baby-killers", "cannon-fodder", and "murderers"..."

If you kill babies, you're a baby-killer.

If you march in lockstep off to a war you know is wrong for politicians who hate everything America really is supposed to stand for without question, then you are cannon-fodder.

If you commit murder, you are a murder.

Words mean things. Stop playing mind games with yourself and face reality.

As far as "respecting servicemen" goes, no such respect is due automatically.

I have far more respect for those in uniform who said, "No." and refused to participate in an illegal war.

As a wise man once said, "If you seek an end to terrorism, that's easy: Stop participating in it."

"I invite any jv liberals to square away your bretheren. This thread would be a good place to start policing your own."

Really? Any just how, pray tell are they going to do that? If you don't like what I write, then you are cordially invited to stop reading and FOAD. No doubt the truth is hard for you to bear.

Police this, Junior.

Thom-
I understand you are very angry. However, you are not succeeding in stating your opinions (which you have a right too) very well when you combine them with ad hominem attacks and vitriol. Instead, you create a caricature of yourself and others that hold your beliefs.
By using comments such as "You seek to salve your putrid, rotted souls with fake "patriotism" and feel-good sloganeering ...It's so much less than you actually deserve for your evil deeds."
you come across as a troll, one of the lowest inhabitants of the internet just above virus-coders and spammers.
Learn how to form a respectful opinion.

Thanx TJ! For demonstrating that the wing of the ALD which held up the sign which said "we support our troops who shoot their officers" is still loud and proud.

ALD = American Liberal/Democrat

TJ - Enlighten me about your illegal war comment. What was illegal about a war duly approved by Congress? Putz.