August 10, 2009
Pelosi, Hoyer Decry First Amendment as "Un-American;" Are Dead-Silent on Democratic Violence
Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi (D-CA) and House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer (D-MD) have their editorial posted this morning as Drudge promised. Pelosi and Hoyer lambasted grassroots protests at town hall health care meetings as "un-American." If one were capable of feeding a monster on hypocrisy, this editorial would satiate the beast from Cloverfield.
There is simply no need to go into detail about the kind of disruptive protests that Pelosi has directly praised coming from her fellow progressives in recent years. If you want or need those details, however—perhaps to help a friend with a convenient case of amnesia—some of my fellow bloggers have taken the time to do just that.
I think what annoys me the most about this progressive Congress and President is the fact that they are quite supportive of fake grassroots (astroturf) efforts from groups they have organized and supported both vocally and financially (ACORN, MoveOn.org, ANSWER, Code Pink), but they then turn around and lash out at real grassroots efforts of self-organized local citizens that came together via blogs and Facebook pages.
The simple face of the matter is that the progressives do not want dissent. They want obedience. As the President himself said last week, opponents of his plan should shut up so that he can pass the legislation he wants.
Towards that end, Democrats aren't above calling in union muscle. They are more than willing to buy silence with pushes, punches, and kicks. The did so around the nation last week, and to the best I can determine, there has been precisely no condemnation from Democratic politicians for that orchestrated violence. Why would there be, when they ordered it?
But these same spoiled children of the left have the temerity to cry out in anger when a frustrated protester suggests that future Democratic violence should be met with violence. You can't have it both ways, Democrats.
Let citizens voice their opinions without attacking them, without demonizing them, without calling them evil or smearing them as part of some of a political machine. Perhaps if Madame Pelosi and Mr. Hoyer and the other progressive Democrats trying to ram this deeply-flawed bill down the throats of Americans were actually open to real debate on Capitol Hill, they wouldn't encounter so much vocal opposition in the rest of America.
Posted by Confederate Yankee at August 10, 2009 10:08 AM
The people disrupting the discussions have been lied to over and over. They are being inflamed and encouraged to act like at best morons at worst thugs and ignorant idiots--let's call them that!!
They bring their children dressed up in teeshirts picturing our president as Hitler. They urge the kids to shout along calling others "Nazis". I have watched video from many of these meetings and it sure looks UN-AMERICAN to me. It looks insane--but these people bear half the blame themselves. The issues they scream about are straight off Comedy Central.
They have been told about--death councils, private insurance made illegal, mandatory abortion, mandatory death counciling, canceling medicare, prescription drugs rationed, socialism, nazism and on and on...oh by the way the racist President is not really an American.
These are the lies propagated by the GOP and their front groups. They don't want any calm reading or discussion---that might show people that this bill is in America's best interest. The opposition wants this to go away without discussion. They want all these people to just go home divided with visions of mayhem to remember.
Just like the WMD's and Mushroom clouds of years just past--the GOP hopes Americans really are as stupid as they were before--believing Bush and Cheney.
I hope they wake up to their embarrassing behavior and search out the perpetrators of all the lies.
What makes it really disconcerting is that we have military people overseas dying as this President and Congress are trying to ram through leftist bills and calling American citizens unpatriotic. Many of these tea party attendees are probably parents and relatives of those serving overseas. How dare this President and Congress be so dishonorable? What the media is not getting since they are so immersed in their wealthy, liberal mindsets, is that the healthcare takeover is the tipping point. It is the last straw so to speak after the Stimulus Bill, cap and trade and the apology tour for many Americans and to diminish it and demonize those very citizens who work, pay taxes and send their loved ones off to fight for America is just disgusting. Remember this Summer of Govt Hate '09 at the polls.
What makes it really disconcerting is that we have military people overseas dying as this President and Congress are trying to ram through leftist bills and calling American citizens unpatriotic. Many of these tea party attendees are probably parents and relatives of those serving overseas. How dare this President and Congress be so dishonorable? What the media is not getting since they are so immersed in their wealthy, liberal mindsets, is that the healthcare takeover is the tipping point. It is the last straw so to speak after the Stimulus Bill, cap and trade and the apology tour for many Americans and to diminish it and demonize those very citizens who work, pay taxes and send their loved ones off to fight for America is just disgusting.
The Left can't handle the truth!!! American ciitizens have had enough of Obama's socialism and aren't about to let it take over their lives in the guise of health care.
The loons on the left's fall back position is always Alinsky Rule #13: Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, and polarize it. Hence you see tha demonization of American citizens expressing their outrage over tyranny and the further loss of their freedom and liberties.
Jeff, I would beg to disagree. Please don't give any credit to the GOP. That party can not organize its way out of a paper bag if its life depends on it.
I don't know what lies you are talking about. I, along with many of the people from these town hall meetings, have read the bill. You think we are so stupid that we can't think for ourselves? Let me tell you the difference between a conservative and a liberal. A liberal waits for marching orders because he is accustomed to group think. A conservative will think for himself, right or wrong.
The Tea Party has no national leader. I am involved in our local Tea Party, and I have no idea who these people are from whom we are supposed to be taking marching orders. I read a lot about the issues and pass them on to my group. I never tell them what to think, but I inform them. It's up to them to do with it what they want.
As for wanting this issue to go away without discussion, excuse me but it's the Democrats who don't want any discussion.
They lie, sir, when they say that the bill will not raise taxes (see Section 421 on taxes on small business and Section 401 on taxes on the uninsured). They lie when they say that this bill will save $6 billion a year (see CBO). And they lie when they say you can keep your health insurance if you like it (see Section 141 and 142).
If anyone is laboring under a cloud of ignorance, it is not the people who ask questions and deride the politicians who lie to them. The politicians have not read this bill as well as we have, and it shows in their ignorant and untruthful answers.
So please stop the projection. Understand what the nature of conservatism is and you will see that we are nothing like you.
These lefty fascists like Pelosi would be really quite funny... if WE weren't the ones they were planning to control, that is.
Now the DNC is deploying AFL-CIO palookas while at the same time hypocritically dismissing Obamacare opponents as paid shills -even running TV ads to slander them- and delirious SanFranNan is seeing imaginary Swastikas.
This should make clear to anyone just what these power-drunk elitists think of your opinion.
Note that whenever Obama, Emanuel, or Gibbs are asked about why polls show SO many people oppose their misguided Cap-n-Trade and Obamacare proposals, they ALWAYS segue-right-into “we need to educate the public…”.
LOL- save your breath... Constitutionally-aware American patriots don’t take lectures from Marxists.
Regarding my post above, the employer taxes come in in Section 411 and 412, not 421.
Posted by: jeff at August 10, 2009 11:31
The people disrupting the discussions have been lied to over and over. They are being inflamed and encouraged to act like at best morons at worst thugs and ignorant idiots--let's call them that!!
Yes, they have been lied to. Don't forget to include by the President, his apologists in the press, his administration and both houses of Congress. You confuse this as a GOP issue at your progressive peril. We are angry at ALL of the European traveling, big money spending and yes LYING politicians of both parties. We keep hearing that Obama is "personally" popular. His policies, not so much. The reason for this is that many Democrats will support him and the party no matter how huge the resulting disaster is. Look at all of the Democratically controlled entities in America to see their successes: public education, Chicago, Detroit, Philadelphia Washington D.C. New Jersey, California and Michigan to name a few. Add in the union run enterprises and we say NO! The reason Bush had such low popularity is because many Republicans saw his big spending "crossing the aisle" agreements with Democrats as bad for the country. Democrats are NEVER able to look past their own self interests. Fortunately, the so called independents are now seeing the results of unfettered Democratic rule. If you believe that Obama's "get in their face" and "bringing a knife to a gun fight" rhetoric is reasoned as he implores his "organized community" is statesman-like, then who is the moron?
They are being inflamed and encouraged to act like at best morons at worst thugs and ignorant idiots--let's call them that!!
...They bring their children dressed up in teeshirts picturing our president as Hitler. They urge the kids to shout along calling others "Nazis". I have watched video from many of these meetings and it sure looks UN-AMERICAN to me.
Do you have links to those videos, jeff? I'd hate to think we're being lied to.
Now shut up and take your medicine. http://www.cagle.com/working/090804/kelley.jpg
Jeff has been busy. He sent the same identical message to QandO and other blogs. Big O astroturfing?
>>"They don't want any calm reading or discussion---"
Yeah, the Democrats are all about "calm reading and discussion". That's why they keep ramming through bills without bothering to allow anybody to read them first. Or in some cases, without even bothering to WRITE them first.
But never mind those silly details! The Democrats party line is that their efforts to have "discussion" are being foiled by Republican "mobs" waving "Nazi symbols", and that is the line which their paid internet operatives will repeat, over and over, until they are given something else to say.
I'm not bothered by the Nazi comments. People should be free to hold whatever silly opinions they want. What crosses the line into Un-American behavior is when someone wants to silence my voice by shouting over me or chanting "KILL THE BILL" over and over.
Debate and dissent is as American as apple pie. Shutting down debate is un-American. Period. Everyone in the town halls should have the chance to converse with their congressman.
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."
Unamerican, I'm not sure. I do know that the Gov't cannot make laws governing the "peacable" assembly of Americans, but can bring down the full might of the Law when these Americans decide to be unpeaceable.
Screaming protest, bullying, and threatening/committing acts of violence are not protected by the 1st Amendment. In fact, they are the trademark of The Brownshirts that helped Hitler rise to power.
Really, if Republicans want to bring moderate conservatives back into their party, they need to quit acting like idiots. Frankly, I might agree with all you have to say, but if you act like 10yo kids throwing temper tantrums, no one is going to even listen to a word you say - they will instanty dismiss you as ignorant.
Its obvious that Congressional Democrats and the President himself are feeling more and more off-balance and afraid. It seems that these little gangsters, even though they have a lock on legislation, lack conviction for their latest poorly disguised power play. Their predictability leaves me cold. The more the public exercises its right of free speech, the more paranoic our "representatives" become. Pity.
People are ANGRY. We were against the Bush bailouts but no one listened. We were against the stimulus (porkulous) but no one listened. We were against cap and tax but no one listened. When healthcare 'reform' looked like it was going to a vote - we called, we faxed and again no one listened. So when the (obviously) deaf congressman comes home - we have to shout so HE WILL FINALLY LISTEN. Wake up people - those of us who actually pay the taxes for all these programs are fed up. Perhaps we should hire ACORN -- maybe then Washington will listen.
...if you act like 10yo kids throwing temper tantrums, no one is going to even listen to a word you say ...
I'm not seeing a lot of that. True, there was this, but that sort of behavior isn't widespread.
I think everyone is angry over the proposed Gov't run healthcare plan. What gives Pelosi and Hoyer the right to call the people who don't agree with them - "Nazi, troublemaker, or part of a right-wing conspiracy.
WAKE UP AMERICA - one way to get their attention is at re-election time The first to go should be Pelosi followed by hoyer and Reed. Remember this is America, land of the FREE and we DO have the right to disagree with the White House and Congress.
>>"Screaming protest, bullying, and threatening/committing acts of violence are not protected by the 1st Amendment. In fact, they are the trademark of The Brownshirts that helped Hitler rise to power."
Screaming protest, bullying, and threatening/committing acts of violence are also the trademark of the Democratic Party, as anybody who was not sound asleep over the last eight years would know.
"What makes it really disconcerting is that we have military people overseas dying as this President and Congress are trying to ram through leftist bills and calling American citizens unpatriotic."
Why don't you bring your poor old granny and her iron lung into the mix while you're at it? Maybe a sick puppy?
Folks like you have set American debate and dialogue back at least a hundred years. I wouldn't be surprised if you start bringing your f7890ing guns to our Town Hall meetings.
Here's reality for you, but I know you are too frightened to check it out, so why bother....
Frankly, I might agree with all you have to say...
So, what you're saying, is that even though we could very well be 100% correct, you won't side with the angels because there might be a few people out there yelling--talk about ignorant and, additionally, disingenuous.
It gets scary when committed fascists like Terry feel comfortable airing their ideology while at the same time employing the brown shirt tactics of beating and assaulting all those who dissent from their point of view. And remember, these are the same people who said dissent was the highest form of patriotism during the entire Bush presidency. Now that Terry and her fellow fascists are in charge there is to be no dissent.
"Screaming protest, bullying, and threatening/committing acts of violence are not protected by the 1st Amendment. In fact, they are the trademark of The Brownshirts that helped Hitler rise to power."
What Terry is trying to say here is that the tactics used by the libs during the past eight years are un-American. Thanks, Terry, for clearing that up.
>>"Folks like you have set American debate and dialogue back at least a hundred years."
Right, the democrats screeching that they were living in a fascist dictatorship for the last eight years had no impact at all on "American debate and dialogue".
Pardon me if I laugh at your sudden faux interest in civil debate.
>>"Here's reality for you"
Ha ha ha. The same clowns who spent eight years insisting that it was un-American not to "question authority" are now taking their "reality" directly from the government.
Way to speak truth to power! I'm trying to imagine if, during the Bush years, I'd shown you a link to the White House web site as "proving" that Bush was right about something.
I'm trying, but failing.
Just because 30% of Democrats (at one time) believed 9/11 was an inside job (ludicrous), that didn't mean they were wrong in their protest of the Iraq War.
In the same way, just because some who are protesting this Health Care Bill may or may not have gone off the deep end, that doesn't mean that the basic resistance to it is not fundamentally sound.
The Left will continue to try to paint this movement as "loony" and will likely (I think) break out the race card to see if that might help them... Do any of these tactics answer the protesters basic questions? No, not at all.
WONDER WHY OBAMA DID NOT APOLOGIZE TO MEXICO, AS IS HIS CUSTOM, FOR AMERICA'S USE OF MARIJUANA .
When I read comments on this blog from the lefties I sit in complete wonderment of what planet they live on. It is amazing how incredibly naive/stupid/ignorant they appear in their run on dribble. See jeff's first post!
Please indulge me here for a moment. I was having a conversation with a friend today and he pointed out to me that when the Senate was investigating steroids in baseball they spent weeks on the investigation, paraded though dozens of experts and participants and stars, spent a lot of time and money investgating the issue and held numerous meetings - yet here we are dealing with 1/6th or more of the entire U.S. GDP and we are having it rammed down our throats without any discussion - WOW!!! Truely beyond comprehension.
Second indulgement - when I was young - 1950's - 1960's - I remember both houses doing indepth investigations into almost any major issue before the American people. I can't begin to tell you the time/effort/money put into the debates/meetings/investigations/testimony when President Johnson was developing that great socialist program called "The Great Society." Here we are 40+ years later and $TRILLIONS$ of your tax dollars wasted - again we are having health care change being demanded by Obama to be voted on blindly!!!!
Thanks for indulging me. We have no choice but to be successful in stopping/slowing what is happening at the hands of the demo/lefties.
Count on it, gustav. I didn't see any SEIU goons in TX this weekend. Wonder why? Because we have concealed carry and immunity from lawsuits when we shoot union goons trying to stomp us.
"The simple fact of the matter is that the progressives do not want dissent. They want obedience."
If Obama and Pelosi along with their lies will have the United States in a Dictatorship in the next few years follow what has happened so far.
whats even more wierd is how some media act.with all that is happining in the area of blatent lies told to our faces.you would think they would be jumping out of there skin doing investigations.they go on tv callin us rednecks and rightwing nutcases.ya think there trying to hurt our feelings?its startin to remind me of a bad movie.
Charles, the media is nothing more than an agent for the democrat party.
Jeff and Gustav have answered Obama's call. Don't be surprised if the non-obama supporters names appears on a hit list. I expected to see a lot more of that, maybe just maybe some of the Dems are waking up!
Jeff, are they paying you 11-$15 an hour? If not, check those Craigs List ads.
"...bullying, and threatening/committing acts of violence are not protected by the 1st Amendment. In fact, they are the trademark of The Brownshirts that helped Hitler rise to power."
The bullying and violence so far has been from SEIU and Union thugs not the ObamaCare opponents. You're also an idiot if you think that this is a "Republican" thing, many people are more accurately labeled conservatives, independents, and even some of the more conservative Democrats are opposed to this travesty.
I'm opposed to this bill and as far as I'm concerned the Republicans don't really represent me. Most haven't since Reagan, but are more Democrat-Lite these days.
Gustav is another Dumbocrat who gets his "reality" from group think. I don't need Obama's reality check because I got mine here.
The bill itself, why don't you read it yourself rather than watch some "expert" tell you what it will or won't do. Oh I know...TLDR right?
"I'm opposed to this bill and as far as I'm concerned the Republicans don't really represent me. Most haven't since Reagan, but are more Democrat-Lite these days."
Posted by Scott at August 11, 2009 11:09 AM
In a sense, Scott is correct. There really isn't a national party that represents the far right wing or the far left wing of American Politics. Both the Republican and the Democrat (though perhaps to a bit lesser extent) parties are in the pockets of Big Business.
While it is true that there are some policy differences between the two parties, the leadership of both major parties realize that they can't appeal only to the extreme wings of their parties if they have any hope at all of winning national elections.
It's pretty much a dog and pony show. You folks who are on the far, far right, the so called "conservatives" who follow the teachings of Limbaugh, Colter, Beck, etc. will have to form a new party if you want someone who truly represents your views.
Come on Dude, come clean, you must realize Obama, Pelosi, Durbin and that gang are on the far, far, far, far left. If you don't, I've lost all hope for you.
To paraphrase good old Will Rogers, "All I know is what I read on the internet!"
I think that many people on the far, far, far, far, left are disappointed with the Obama administration and his allies in Congress. That's also my observation from conversations with my "more" liberal friends.